Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Well it does to the people who post here... dispassionate and reasoned debate, with a good deal of humour thrown in for good measure.

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High Peak
Posts: 146
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:49 pm
Parish / Diocese: Diocese of Nottingham
Location: Derbyshire

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by High Peak » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:40 pm

alan29 wrote:And more often those charisms are absent.


Or latent or nascent, perhaps.

And that's where formation and training is SO important.

I am naturally fairly musical, but have absolutely no formal musical or liturgical training. Neither, when I was asked to start our music group, was any reading - never mind training - suggested or offered. It's only because I'm OCD that I started to research, discovered this forum, etc., etc. The more I discovered, the more I wanted to learn and understand and thus inform my ministry as well as others in the music group. But I could quite easily have just produced a hymn sandwich every week and absolutely nothing would have been said.

alan29
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Joined: Fri May 27, 2005 8:04 pm
Location: Wirral

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by alan29 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:40 am

High Peak wrote:
alan29 wrote:And more often those charisms are absent.


Or latent or nascent, perhaps.

And that's where formation and training is SO important.

I am naturally fairly musical, but have absolutely no formal musical or liturgical training. Neither, when I was asked to start our music group, was any reading - never mind training - suggested or offered. It's only because I'm OCD that I started to research, discovered this forum, etc., etc. The more I discovered, the more I wanted to learn and understand and thus inform my ministry as well as others in the music group. But I could quite easily have just produced a hymn sandwich every week and absolutely nothing would have been said.


You are to be congratulated. I hope you are given verbal support and encouragement by your PP at the very least.
Each diocese has a Liturgy Commission. I wonder what they actually get up to .... apart from have meetings. If that is where expertise is concentrated you would hope they were active in disseminating knowledge and best practise one way or another. I wonder if anyone has ever done a survey??

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Gwyn
Posts: 1118
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:42 pm
Parish / Diocese: Archdiocese of Cardiff
Location: Abertillery, South Wales UK

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by Gwyn » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:06 am

Each diocese has a Liturgy Commission.

I don't think that the Cardiff diocese has one. It certainly needs one. There were at one time a few flagship parishes; otherwise it's meagre fayre. Best bet is Roath's St Martin's (Anglican) church.

Keraulophon
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:22 pm
Parish / Diocese: Southwark - Kent

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by Keraulophon » Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:23 am


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Gwyn
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Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:42 pm
Parish / Diocese: Archdiocese of Cardiff
Location: Abertillery, South Wales UK

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by Gwyn » Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:27 pm

Keraulophon highlighted . . .
According to the diocesan website
http://rcadc.org/commissions-committees ... ommission/

I wonder what they do?

alan29
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Joined: Fri May 27, 2005 8:04 pm
Location: Wirral

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by alan29 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:23 pm

Gwyn wrote:Keraulophon highlighted . . .
According to the diocesan website
http://rcadc.org/commissions-committees ... ommission/

I wonder what they do?


No mention of music.

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Gwyn
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Parish / Diocese: Archdiocese of Cardiff
Location: Abertillery, South Wales UK

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by Gwyn » Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:10 pm

It was good at one time, there was the Cardiff Archdiocesan Music Resource Group - a bit fluffy-libby but not at all bad for that. It certainly did what it says on the tin; i.e. armed parish musicians with resources of varying levels in order that liturgies could be revitalised. Its aim wasn't to improve the Mass, we can't do that; rather it aimed to enrich the celebration.

I wonder what became of it? Maybe poor support from people like me contributed to its demise. Mea culpa.

Southern Comfort
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Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2008 12:31 pm

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by Southern Comfort » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:15 pm

alan29 wrote:
Gwyn wrote:Keraulophon highlighted . . .
According to the diocesan website
http://rcadc.org/commissions-committees ... ommission/

I wonder what they do?


No mention of music.


I think you can take it as read that with Frances Bibey on the Commission (actually its Secretary), and given her roles with SSG as a Trustee and Commissioning Editor of the journal, music will certainly be on the Commission's agenda. I know that she and Jennifer Burridge have run successful workshop days in the past, and perhaps still do. Gwyn, it sounds as if you need to ask Frances to get you back in the loop.

blackthorn fairy
Posts: 87
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:36 am
Parish / Diocese: Our Lady of the Sacred Heart Wellingborough Northamptonshire

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by blackthorn fairy » Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:05 pm

I too have just re-read Musicam Sacram - and was pleased with what I read. It's all there really.

justMary
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Parish / Diocese: Galway Republic of Ireland

Re: Music and Church: Cult and Culture 50 years after Musicam Sacram

Post by justMary » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:36 pm

though the same style will not appeal to everyone


And more importantly the same style will not evangelise / nourish / engage everyone.

As I've got older and more musically aware, I've found spiritual riches in material which sounded like pretentious caterwauling in my younger years, and I've found that material which used to focus my on Jesus now sounds trite.

Pretty such I'm not alone in such maturation - and that it cannot be hurried, and is not guaranteed.

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