That final hymn!

Well it does to the people who post here... dispassionate and reasoned debate, with a good deal of humour thrown in for good measure.

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docmattc
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That final hymn!

Post by docmattc »

In September I abolished the final hymn for most occasions, moving to a hymn of thanksgiving (usually) after communion and a voluntary to accompany the procession at the end of Mass. We explained to the congregation the reasons for this as given in "Celebrating the Mass".

The change has met with surprisingly little opposition (at least that has got back to me) and some support. Mostly chuntering has been as a result of the "this is not what I'm used to so I don't like it" attitude.

I can however see a problem in Advent if I follow Musicam Sacram
The playing of these same instruments as solos is not permitted in Advent...
as we're going to be left with an uncomfortable silence during which the priest leaves which I can see may precipitate mutiny from those who miss their final hymn.
I guess the obvious solution is to follow GIRM
In Advent the organ and other musical instruments should be used with a
moderation that is consistent with the season’s character and does not anticipate the full joy of the Nativity of the Lord.
and play a subdued voluntary, but how do we reconcile these two seemingly conflicting documents, and what do I do with the same problem in Lent?
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Gwyn
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Post by Gwyn »

Why not have a recessional song/hymn just in Advent and Lent? This in itself would serve to emphasise the different texture of those liturgical seasons.

I do like a nice recessional myself. I've only experienced organ twiddling at the end of services in the C-of-E while the vicar and the three thyrotoxic octogenarian contraltos that form the choir amble to the vestry, the organist usually busking some sickly, over-sentimentalised rubbish as they go, mostly on a vox angelica manual stop and a bourdon on the pedal.

Maybe my image has perhaps become a little tainted, but as a church-wanderer of forty years this has only come about by experience.

V/ From such terrible practices that have contributed to empty Anglican churches.

R/ Good Lord, deliver us. :lol:
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contrabordun
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Post by contrabordun »

Gwyn wrote: the organist usually busking some sickly, over-sentimentalised rubbish as they go, mostly on a vox angelica manual stop and a bourdon on the pedal


Hey, don't knock it. I get paid good money for that sort of thing, and it saves a lot of practice time.

Anyway, you forgot half the registration. Any fule know the correct procedure for this situation is (rh) Sw strings (sub Howellian rambling chords at random) (lh) quiet Ch reed (or Gt Stopped Diapason if no alternative) busking oversentimental (etc) in tenor register. Sw/Ped. Ped Bordon.
docmattc
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Post by docmattc »

Gwyn wrote: the organist usually busking some sickly, over-sentimentalised rubbish as they go, mostly on a vox angelica manual stop and a bourdon on the pedal


Afraid I don't have much time for sickly rubbish. I tend to go for rubbish on full organ, or solo trumpets! People should leave feeling uplifted and not sickly. Not yet plucked up the courage to follow the lead of the organist at St Peter's Rome and play the Dm toccata and fugue as he did after the Pope's inauguration, but it will appear one day!
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contrabordun
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Post by contrabordun »

Well a good opportunity would be 18th December

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/classical/bachtfc.shtml

always assuming one is allowed to (vide the on-topic part of this thread)
docmattc
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Post by docmattc »

contrabordun wrote:Well a good opportunity would be 18th December

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/classical/bachtfc.shtml

always assuming one is allowed to (vide the on-topic part of this thread)


I might just do it then. I confess the fugue is a bit beyond me, but I can manage the toccata well enough for the congregation not to notice the mistakes!

On topic thoughts also welcome!
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sidvicius
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Post by sidvicius »

Perhaps going against the grain, but if
The change has met with surprisingly little opposition ... and some support
then why confuse the congregation by apparently adding more during advent (and/or lent)?

I am completely oblivious to 'after mass voluntaries', which always strike me as some kind of excuse to pull out rarely used (and unsubtle) stops at an inappropriate time - my apologies to those of you who enjoy this exercise. If you must do a voluntary (is it possible for a 'voluntary' to be 'obligatory'?) at least consider carefully your choice of music, in the same way that you would consider the music for the mass.

I don't see what's so 'uncomfortable' about silence either. In lent we tend to drop hymns out one by one - it adds poignancy. At othertimes of year however, I agree that a little music to end with is appreciated, but only because I like to play it and sing it. From the obvious fumbling around by many a congregationer looking for their car keys, I can see this is not a universal appreciation.
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Post by excathedra »

contrabordun wrote:Any fule know...

According to my young friend Molesworth, any fule kno that that should read "Any fule kno". :lol:
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contrabordun
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Post by contrabordun »

or n txt spk ne ful no
Gabriel
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GIRM vs Musicam Sacram

Post by Gabriel »

Where Musicam Sacram and GIRM are at variance GIRM takes precedence. It has greater weight as a General Instruction to liturgical rite as opposed to a curial Instruction. Also Musicam Sacram is post-conciliar but was written before our present Missal and other liturgical books. The change that docmattc notes reflects that change in perception of Advent as different to Lent found in the General Norms in the Liturgical Year.

I did work in a parish where the practice was that they sang a short chant a few times - Taize Laudate Dominum for example at the end of Mass. It rounded things off but did not hold us up. We did end in silence in Lent and as long the priest and other ministers know what they are doing - i.e. not too rushed - it worked very well.
Merseysider
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Post by Merseysider »

Just back from Evening Prayer for the faithful departed.
We sang seven pieces of deliciously slushy music.

Next Wednesday we're celebrating our PP's 20th anniversary – music galore.

Then we have Christ the King with descants all over the place.

And then there's all that delicious Advent music we've just started rehearsing.

And, having dragged ourselves through Christmas, we'll be singing all that stuff about light and water during January. A few weeks later we'll be into the beautiful music of Lent.

Often, I think we have too much music. I love mince pies but get a tad fed up after the 15th box.
docmattc
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Re: GIRM vs Musicam Sacram

Post by docmattc »

Thanks for the clarification Gabriel

Gabriel wrote:I did work in a parish where the practice was that they sang a short chant a few times - Taize Laudate Dominum for example at the end of Mass. It rounded things off but did not hold us up.


Having dropped the final hymn and heard a few comments to the tune of "I miss a final hymn because it makes it feel like Mass has ended", I'm becoming a bit uncomfortable with the need to "round things off".
Surely Mass shouldn't be rounded off in the sense that we can put God back in his box having got the religious bit out of the way for the week. Looking back at it, I wonder if the final hymn was metaphorically shutting the box lid. The 'missionary imperative' that CTM mentions of the dismissal "Go in peace to love and serve the Lord" should fill us with enthusiasm to do just that.[/bible]
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Tsume Tsuyu
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Re: GIRM vs Musicam Sacram

Post by Tsume Tsuyu »

docmattc wrote:"Go in peace to love and serve the Lord" should fill us with enthusiasm to do just that.

Exactly! We haven't dropped the final hymn in our parish but, when we're planning, we never think of that last hymn as rounding things off. Usually, we try to choose 'going forth' hymns, reinforcing "Go in peace to love and serve the Lord". We plump for songs such as Chris Walker's 'Send Us As Your Blessing, Lord', Bernadette Farrell's 'Christ Be Our Light', or someone's 'Lord, You Give the Great Commission'.

We try to fit the theme of the week, but we also try and find a song that will send people out from Mass buzzing with enthusiasm for loving and serving.
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Crumhorn
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Not a popular decision...

Post by Crumhorn »

We decided to drop the final hymn during Lent as a mark of the season (ironically, considering some of the contributions to this thread).

I have never had such a strong response from the congregation. They all wanted it back, and were only slightly mollified by my assurances that it would return for Easter!

So what can one do! We, too, get the 'car key fumbling' syndrome, but only from people who wouldn't sing anyway. For the rest, we aim to send them out with something that allows them a good full-throated belt, and fills them with enthusiasm for the ministry they're being sent out to continue.

Well, that's the theory, anyway... :)
Crumhorn
(Finding new uses for wonderful old ideas!)
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