Unpopular psalms

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Gabriel
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Psalm 112 & 146

Post by Gabriel » Fri Sep 17, 2004 6:03 pm

For anyone thinking of setting this Sunday's psalm (Ps 112) have a look at Psalm 146 on 5 Sunday of Ordinary Time Year B (Praise the Lord who heals the broken hearted) I am not sure which way round it happened but one was easily adapted from the other.

Gabriel

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VML
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Not unpopular, just awkward

Post by VML » Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:32 pm

Someone's got to wake up this message board, so...
What about the psalm for Midnight Mass, which has probably been paraphrased countless times, and is the same for all three years of the cycle?
It has peculiar irregular verses, and I haven't done anything with it ..yet..
We've used the McCrimmon books mostly, but also have a setting offered to me by a (Summer) holiday visitor a few years ago.
Has anyone submitted a setting?

Sorry, I've just remembered it's a Grail text, so not much hope in time for this year. :?

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musicus
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Post by musicus » Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:42 pm

The best published setting that I know is Bernadette Farrell's wonderfully tuneful Christmas Psalm. It's in the collection Christ Be Our Light (OCP). Although the response is long, people pick it up with no trouble. There are optional SATB and handbell (!) parts if you have the resources. Well worth a look.

Musicus

Dot
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Psalm for Christmas Midnight Mass

Post by Dot » Wed Nov 03, 2004 10:39 pm

Has anyone submitted a setting?

Sorry, I've just remembered it's a Grail text, so not much hope in time for this year.


No, VML, no such setting has been submitted to Composers' Group in the last five years, whether or not it could be posted.

Psalm setters: get yourself on a website that has many different translations of the Psalms, (eg Bible Gateway, Blue Letter Bible) and do your own paraphrasing once you have the meaning clear in your mind. Then you can claim the text as your own and there is no need to seek permission to use it. You will also be spared the indignity of having to tussle with clumsy lines such as those found in this week's Psalm for the 32nd Sunday of Yr C (eg. "and be filled, when I awake, with the sight of your glory.")

dot

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Re: Psalm for Christmas Midnight Mass

Post by Merseysider » Wed Nov 03, 2004 10:46 pm

Please remove

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Gwyn
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Two possible responses to Psalm 16 (32nd Sun Year C)

Post by Gwyn » Thu Nov 04, 2004 8:54 am

Here's two quick paraphrases of this coming Sunday's (32 C) response.

Your glory will enfold (enshroud) me as I wake in you, O Lord.

Your glory fills my being as I wake in you, O Lord.

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PD Source for the Latin Psalms

Post by dunstan » Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:32 am

Is there a handy public domain source for the psalms in Latin?

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contrabordun
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Post by contrabordun » Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:27 pm

The text is here:

http://www.the-orb.net/encyclop/religion/hagiography/psalter/pshome.htm

It's in an HTML table, 1 row per verse, Latin and English columns. You can't copy only the Latin column, but if you copy both and paste into Word, you can then select the Latin column.

It's not as such a public domain site, but since the Latin text is the Vulgate, it's probably out of copyright by now. In any case, it would be polite to mail the site owner and ask, if you're planning to print lots of copies. It's an Online Reference Book for Mediaeval Studies so I shouldn't think they'd be too worried.

When you sell your setting of the entire Psalter for millions, maybe make a donation to site running costs.. :D

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sidvicius
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Vaguely on Topic....

Post by sidvicius » Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:51 pm

Referring to the Psalm after the first reading, can somebody please bring me up to date - I thought latest docs were strongly advising we move away from paraphrase, and stick strictly to what's written?

Dot
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Verbatim or paraphrase?

Post by Dot » Sun Nov 07, 2004 6:33 am

Good point, Sid; that is the thrust of one (much criticised) document.

Disclaimer. I am expressing my own opinion when I make the suggestion to paraphrase. It is not a Society view nor the Church's view, but based on the experience of other people's practice, which is now becoming my own. It seems to me a sensible way to by-pass the need to pay for words which are printed in The Missal, but owned by a publisher. The ICET texts of the Proper of the Mass do not have similar restrictions placed on them.

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mcb
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Re: Vaguely on Topic....

Post by mcb » Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:21 pm

sidvicius wrote:Referring to the Psalm after the first reading, can somebody please bring me up to date - I thought latest docs were strongly advising we move away from paraphrase, and stick strictly to what's written?


There's paraphrasing and there's paraphrasing... I imagine what Dot had in mind was finding a form of words which keeps the meaning of the original completely intact, while simply escaping the shackles of a published translation for the use of which royalties, reasonable or unreasonable, might be payable. This doesn't seem to me to violate any important principle for liturgical usage - as things stand (if I understand correctly) the English and Welsh bishops have authorised more than one translation of the Psalms (the 1963 and 1993 versions of the Grail psalter). So there's nothing sacrosanct about a particular version of the words, provided what you use is a faithful rendition of the original meaning. And we're not all Hebrew scholars, so finding a paraphrase on the basis of a consensus among published translations is more likely to be a fruitful approach. Like Dot, I've no idea whether this is an officially permitted way to deal with psalm texts; but I really wouldn't worry about it.

It's different, then, I reckon, from paraphrasing the English words of, say, the Sanctus. There we have a single approved version of the text, where the form of words itself has ritual significance, it seems to me, and departing significantly from it more obviously involves some impairment to the universal character of liturgical celebrations.

M.

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Common Psalms

Post by Merseysider » Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:28 pm

Does anyone use Common Psalms as suggested in the Lectionary. We're experimenting at the moment, building up a common psalm repertoire but not quite as the Lectionary suggests.

For example, on the 16th Sunday, we probably won't sing Ps85 as prescribed, we'll use 102 ("Slow to anger, rich in mercy) which has a pretty similar theme. Later in the year, Ps24 ("Let me know your ways") might be replaced by Walker's "Teach Me, O God" (Ps118). We have, in past replaced Ps62 with "Like as the deer" (Ps 41/42) – although we'll use Bernadette Farrell's "My soul is yearning" this year" as it comes up twice before Christ the King. We also have a homespun "I will bless your name forever..." with verses from both psalms 144 and 145 which gets us through quite a few Sundays.

The plan is to build up a repertoire of common psalms but for them to be thematic rather than seasonal as the Lectionary suggests.

Just wondered if anyone else was doing anything similar.

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sidvicius
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Grail texts

Post by sidvicius » Wed Jun 08, 2005 8:25 pm

Can't answer Merseysider yet, but I see where mcb is coming from. I notice that the Psalms listed in Celebration Hymnal (665 - 693) are mostly described as Grail texts, even though they aren't exactly the Missal texts. Just one problem - I've never heard of anyone using these.

Can anyone out there say they use the Celebration Psalms, and what sort of congregational reception to they receive?

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Psalm for Midnight Mass

Post by organist » Thu Jan 26, 2006 5:11 am

Fintan O'Carroll has set this memorably - book with white cover published in Dublin! Have a look at Eugene Monaghan's settings "With heart and voice" for the whole 3 year cycle. Lovely Celtic feel to some of them - not all are successful. Avaialbel from the composer in Cardiff.

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sidvicius
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Thread revival

Post by sidvicius » Fri Feb 23, 2007 10:22 pm

sid wrote:Can anyone out there say they use the Celebration [Hymnal] Psalms, and what sort of congregational reception to they receive?


In a quiet moment, I'd like to revive this useful thread. Surely there must be some CH psalms that aren't too bad....?

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