Search found 1803 matches

by Southern Comfort
Fri May 02, 2008 10:23 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Status of Hymns at Mass
Replies: 50
Views: 7670

Re: Status of Hymns at Mass

mcb wrote:So when does the low Mass with hymns date from? Not after the Council, surely?


In Germany, the Betsingmesse [= "Prayer-sing-Mass" or Low Mass with hymns] goes back to 1922, but has its antecedents in 18th-century Germany (documented from the 1770s onwards).
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:31 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Status of Hymns at Mass
Replies: 50
Views: 7670

Re: Status of Hymns at Mass

JW wrote:3) Hymns were not generally sung at Mass before Vatican II - they were reserved for Benediction and other devotions.


With some exceptions. In Germany, the Betsingmesse, with chorales inserted in the liturgy, has been in constant use since the 16th century.
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:00 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Status of Hymns at Mass
Replies: 50
Views: 7670

Re: Status of Hymns at Mass

'By flowing waters', seems to have semi-official approval of the US Bishops. Psallite does not, but uses (mainly) approved translations. (Grail & NRSV). The hymn 'Safe in the shadow of the Lord' (Dudley-Smith), appears in the UK Bishops' evening prayer book, which would again indicate some sort...
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:46 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Status of Hymns at Mass
Replies: 50
Views: 7670

Re: Status of Hymns at Mass

The US bishops put in clauses allowing hymns, Rome agreed, and they issued their GIRM. Ours made a few little edits, did not allow hymns, and obtained Rome's agreement and issued it. The obvious conclusion is that our own bishops would like us to stop substituting hymns for the proper antiphons, bu...
by Southern Comfort
Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:47 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Sung Masses
Replies: 33
Views: 4998

Re: Sung Masses

'Insincere' is the wrong word too; at least, you could argue that it's no great part of the celebrant's role to communicate the sincerity of the greetings, blessings etc. uttered by him - as if sincerity was his to impart or withhold. Something that has been reasserted by the post-Vatican II liturg...
by Southern Comfort
Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:37 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Status of Hymns at Mass
Replies: 50
Views: 7670

Re: Status of Hymns at Mass

Have a look at the Psallite project (http://www.magnificatmusic.com) which provides antiphons + psalms for the entire 3-year cycle.
by Southern Comfort
Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:42 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Sung Masses
Replies: 33
Views: 4998

Re: Sung Masses

Maybe the Orthodox have it right with so much singing? Having everything sung is all right if you are coming from a position of thinking that singing adds a sense of mystery or solemnity, as the Orthodox do. However, there are other considerations. Music highlights what it touches. If you sing ever...
by Southern Comfort
Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:32 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Changes in Oz
Replies: 8
Views: 1421

Re: Changes in Oz

I think genuflections are an excellent idea but I do have problems with tabernacles behind altars. I genuflect once and after that ignore it when crossing the sanctuary. The Ceremonial of Bishops states (para 71) that you genuflect as you arrive and as you leave, but otherwise not; so you're right ...
by Southern Comfort
Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:44 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Changes in Oz
Replies: 8
Views: 1421

Re: Changes in Oz

These are the same changes which were recently introduced in the USA. In both Oz and the States, the previous practice was to stand after completing saying the "May the Lord receive the sacrifice at your hands..." response. Rome decided that they preferred our way of doing it, and is now i...
by Southern Comfort
Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:22 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: ICEL new Missal texts sampler
Replies: 21
Views: 3569

Re: ICEL new Missal texts sampler

Can I make a quick plea that when referring to "the ICEL texts", people are a bit more specific. As I understand it, technically all the translations are ICEL texts. Simplified a bit, I think there are at least 3 sets of them (not all are complete). A-the ones done in a rush after V2 and ...
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:55 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: ICEL new Missal texts sampler
Replies: 21
Views: 3569

Re: ICEL new Missal texts sampler

Indeed. Many priests within 5-10 years of retirement age will consider it all too much effort and simply won't bother to change. And neither will their congregations. The Roman powers-that-be will have succeeded in creating a kind of liturgical anarchy - exactly the opposite of the control they want...
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:04 pm
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: ICEL new Missal texts sampler
Replies: 21
Views: 3569

Re: ICEL new Missal texts sampler

My point is not so much that it will be difficult to proclaim these prayers (though that is indeed true), rather that the listener will not be able to take them in, make sense of them, and indeed find that they can feed his/her spiritual life. I am all in favour of preserving the richness of the old...
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:43 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: ICEL new Missal texts sampler
Replies: 21
Views: 3569

ICEL new Missal texts sampler

Prepare to be somewhat depressed..... I recently received a copy of the Proper of Seasons in "grey book" form - i.e. this is a revised version of the original drafts, and its proponents think it is reasonably final. This was sent out to bishops' conferences last June, but some are only vot...
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:47 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Defend deacons
Replies: 5
Views: 1228

Re: Defend deacons

organist wrote:In another thread


This one, just for info: http://www.ssg.org.uk/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=655
by Southern Comfort
Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:45 am
Forum: Liturgy Matters
Topic: Ministers (lay and ordained) charging for their ministries
Replies: 27
Views: 4100

Re: Ministers (lay and ordained) charging for their ministries

Well, I don't know. You turn your back for a couple of hours and all this off-topic diaconal stuff comes along... Folks, please feel free to start new threads at any time. Going OT makes it very difficult to stay focussed or to find anything retrospectively. Thank you. Sorrrrrry! A nerve was touche...