And now they want to sing Gospel......

[oopsorganist]

Some of our parishioners have asked if we can have more Gospel style songs - they couldn't think of any off hand, but said they would let me know.....it's not that they want to do this themselves you see, just to join in with someone else, possibly a nice choir............. although where I will find one of them is anybody's guess.... and maybe it could be the young people in the parish said they..... ......
Cor, don't you just love 'em!
The thing is they are almost right, I think our parish would resond well to upbeat, jazzy modern, well whatever. And we have a lot of people who might really come alive for music with Gospel roots, if you see what I mean. But not everyone.

Unfortunately or even fortunately I have had a calm year, since my right hand rhythm guitarists fell out with me (something about being disorganised and having a cup half empty ) and I took up the offer of that person leaving the music group, as it happens, I have been happily playing the organ, leading some singing which is improving and better than before without any new material but with sung acclamations whenever possible - and there is a lot to be said for NOT having a committee ethos when it comes to planning....

so - I don't know where to go with all this.

Anyway, this morning one of our parishioners stopped me to talk, then suddenly said, "Oh no, I need to talk to x, because she is in charge". I wonder what is afoot? Maybe x will bring some of her friends along one Sunday as has happened once before in the distant past. We just don't know.

I would quite happily plan, lead, help with Gospel style music, although it's not really my bestest thing but I don't think I can pull it out of a hat by magic. Nor would it please everyone. I was listening to an Oslo Gospel choir on Youtube, they were quite nice and peaceful - but it would not be helpful to try to introduce unkown hymns at our place. So that leaves trying to make traditional hymns more Gospel and I don't think I can do that either. The real problem is lack of singing and (peaceful) people that want to spend any time at all practising and preparing for the music in whatever style.
Any advice?

[oopsorganist]

OH
you see, that is why it is useful to write things down. It's musical illiteracy.

If you have not been part of a choir, group, etc or had any musical training, it will be imagined that such things are easy.... in fact a Gospel choir, especialy if learning everything aurally, will take years of rehearsal and practice to produce good effects, will need very good clear discipline to appear spontaneous and follow the director's lead, and so on. Without the skill to read music everything takes a lot longer.
So they imagine I got up one day able to play the organ and I just do it four square because of my ethnicity, cussedness. I see now.
Doesn't take me nearer the solution though, just further away, cup even more empty....

[nazard]

You sound as if you are in the same mess I got into ten years ago. Then, a group of parishioners asked if we could to something a bit more modern, folky, guitary kind of thing. I found a good guitarist and we did a bit of Bilborough, Kendrick, Lundy et al with a guitar/keyboard accompaniment and the two of us singing. Not funky enough said a couple of elderly ladies and a man in his mid forties, what you need is "Praise and Worship". What's that? I asked. They pointed me at some fairly dismal material, eg "There is a redeemer." We tried to make the best of it but the congregation was upset so we gave up. The three complainers then formed a music group and brought a cheap electro acoustic guitar. Not being sensitive to pitch or knowing how to strum a guitar or read music did not put them off, and they persuaded father to put them on the music rota. Three tone deaf parish priests and ten years later, we have half the congregation we started with.

I have tried to teach them a little, but they say I am too finicky. Three to the bar, four to the bar, major cord, minor cord, on the beat, off the beat... What does it matter? When singing in two parts surely the two parts don't need to be sung in the same key, that's just pedantic.

I have heard Praise and Worship and Gospel material done well. In my opinion you need half a dozen instrumentalists and a dozen strong singers, all of whom are prepared to practice.

All this has left me with a love for tridentine low mass with no music. There I can pray, which might just be what its all about.

I pray you have better luck than me.

[oopsorganist]

That is the exact it of it Nazard.

Good music by and large, wellish, requires lots of people with lots of skill and lots of discipline. Self discipline. And a really good leader is required for good Gospel and that ain't me.
I have found this last year, one woman and an organ, to be pretty effective and the church is full.

They'll just have to make do with a brisk pace and the occasional lively rendition of How Lovely on the Mountains.
Sheish
It's not like I can get them into dibbling anything of Farrell repertoire. Sheish. Sigh.

[SOP]

Ooops, it sounds as if you are doing a good job as you are and have settled into a routine. In some ways it is good people are coming up and suggesting things to you instead of just moaning about you behind your back. You would try telling them you need a much bigger choir and at least one very good solo voice and then ask them if you they know of anyone.

Don't let them get you down or take it to heart. They probably want what you are doing plus - not instead of.

If you did get a gospel choir going, how long do you think it would be before the complaints rolled in about the swaying and clapping????

SMILE - you are doing a good job.

[musicus]

Oops, SOP is talking sense. It sounds to me like you are doing fine. You don't have to implement every suggestion that comes your way. If you did want to expand the range a bit, then I would be inclined to say something along these lines: "Hmm. Gospel music. That requires a high degree of musical expertise in that particular style, and I don't have that. Do you know anyone who does, who would be prepared to help?"

But if they can't even name one or two Gospel songs... well, it sounds like a chance remark to me.

[presbyter]

Keep up your good work oops

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm - Gospel - Hope they are doing some for the Papal Visit.

[oopsorganist]

oh thanks
I just hammer on. It's not good, I don't kid myself. But if God had other plans he'd send someone else along yes?

The lady who is so keen, comes wearing African dress and so do a few others. We have a little community gathering. But I don't know how to meet their needs. The other lady, Powerful X has links into the African Carribean community in the city. And then we have a French speaking group, some African origin. This is the way it goes some places now.

Clapping might be the only thing the various groups actually have in common musically.

But I have had another idea. I could invest in some World CDs to play before and after mass. Just to see what people actually like and take it from there.

I have been out and around some local African churches here a little. They have huge sound systems but the singing was not brilliant and it would not go down well with some people. Parishioners just smile when I sing a bit of what I call Gospel back at them - but - I have worked with a children's choir on this so I know a little about it. Enough to know I know a little.

They want something I can't deliver, a focus for their young adults for a start, which ain't part of my brief.

I'll try some CDs and see what happens.

Maybe it is a problem that is bigger than our parish, a need for sustenance for some in their culture which is only a part of what a parish can offer. Would the diocese start a Gospel choir? I would go. ( I quite like clapping).
Thanks for listening.

[VML]

Africa's a big place. And Gospel music sounds wonderful well done, but toe curlingly awful whe the average unpractised English Catholic parish tries it, which is probably why one of my favourite Gospel Blues, 'Just a closer walk with Thee,' that was in the Celebration book, is not in CFE.
I have tried approaching some of our newcomers from different countries and have found from the few from whom I have had any response that: 1.The people who have move to this country are not necessariy well versed in the Mass music from their own countries, and 2.Using music from one or two 'other' cultures will not even begin to relate to all the incomers.

To take your original point of suggestions from the pews: We had a couple of hymns we are using for Lent printed on sheets yeaterday. We are even up to date with copyright returns. But a lady who occasionally joins in with the alternative music group came and said, ' We really need some new hymn books don't we.' I said that it is not going to happen, except that we are buying full music for our musicians and even if we had new books we would not find everything we use in them. So she suggested an overhead screen, for which our sideways-on chuch is particularly unsuitable, if indeed any screen could really be OK at Mass. This lady did offer to help with the alternative group a few years ago, 'to revive the Mass.' Gee, thanks! She then brought me the music to a worship song in E flat that the writer specifically said should be sung unaccompanied, and asked me to write in the chords, bocause she doesn't read music.
I'm only telling you this to show you you are not alone.
You are clearly doing a very good job in your parish and they are fortunate to have you.

[johnquinn39]

The music group I am in occasionally sing James Moore's 'Taste and see'. This is in the 'Gospel' style, but is quite
straighforward and traditional.

Hope this is of some help,

John

PS - I have composed a 'Motown' style setting of the RP - The just will live in the presence of the Lord ...
you know the one - 'Those who keep their word etc.', or the MAN who keeps is word as we shall soon be singing.

[johnquinn39]

Keep up your good work oops

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm - Gospel - Hope they are doing some for the Papal Visit.

So do I. But is there room for other types of music? - We are, after all, the Catholic Church (or were before 'Authentic Liturgy' and the 'New Missal'.)

[oopsorganist]

thanks to above
I think I will also ask PP to bless the bigger communities in Masses after Easter... specifically in bidding prayers and so on.. maybe we could join up thinking a bit and have some folks offer food after along a theme. This has been suggested and offered by groups before but fallen away due to lack of organisation and kind of apathy. Just to sort of acknowledge and well, bless.

VML we bought a set of the older CFE (without supplement) the ones with a short supplement at the back.... and then added the new CFE which is with Supplement ie has no supplement at the back but includes newer etc hymns in the main numbers (confusing, yes, a little) but these bigger books are beginning to split along the spines.. only two years old and to be honest, I am not utterly sure that they have had hard wear. Don't want to diss the book but it is a fault and a problem.
Off topic sos bear.

[presbyter]

Hope they are doing some for the Papal Visit.


So do I. But is there room for other types of music?

I think you have to ask that question in the Papal Visit thread.

[nazard]

... one of my favourite Gospel Blues, 'Just a closer walk with Thee,' that was in the Celebration book...

Nice, that. I'd never come across it before. I might give it a go.

[VML]

I first learnt it as a folk blues, and got to sing it at a requiem about 20 years ago. A parishioner came up and said she was so moved she would like me to sing it for her funeral. She is over 80 now and was at Mass tonight. I'd be amazed if she still remembers.
Try and hear the Judith Durham version, or there are lots on YouTube.
Still not really one for the congregation IMHO.